Clutch issues and more...

[jim157]

There seems to be a fair amount of slop/play in the actuator arm where cable locates, I dont have another CRM to compare to but all my other bikes have no play in the arm whatsoever. I'm wondering if the top bearing had been knackered for so long that it actually increased the wear in the arm?


There's a secondhand cable and actuator arm on ebay, I dont really like paying top dollar for parts that will probably be as knackered as my own but I've got to the stage now where I just want to get it sorted.

[jim157]

I've a feeling I might've located the issue. At sometime in the past the chain has jumped off and damaged the case in front of the sprocket. This in turn has deformed the hole the actuator sits in (I guess that why the top bearing was destroyed?) preventing it turning smoothly through its full range of travel. I only discovered this damage after removing the sprocket cover.

I'm guessing it deformed the new top bearing when I drifted it in too as the actuator is a super tight fit in the hole.

I'm going to attempt to file out the deformation in the hole and fit a new bearing. Hopefully that will sort it.


On a slightly unreleated note the mk3 and ar clutch cables are the same length but the mk3 cable has a longer (about a cm) threaded adjuster. Cant imagine that would make a massive difference...

[jompy]

good luck bud hope you get it sorted

[fallenmikethebike]

I've a feeling I might've located the issue. At sometime in the past the chain has jumped off and damaged the case in front of the sprocket. This in turn has deformed the hole the actuator sits in (I guess that why the top bearing was destroyed?) preventing it turning smoothly through its full range of travel. I only discovered this damage after removing the sprocket cover.

I'm guessing it deformed the new top bearing when I drifted it in too as the actuator is a super tight fit in the hole.

I'm going to attempt to file out the deformation in the hole and fit a new bearing. Hopefully that will sort it.


On a slightly unreleated note the mk3 and ar clutch cables are the same length but the mk3 cable has a longer (about a cm) threaded adjuster. Cant imagine that would make a massive difference...

what as a % is that extra 10mm of the overall length of threaded section?
I still wouldn't expect there to be a need for that much adjustment on a new clutch set!!!
Mike

[jim157]

The mk3 cable has 50mm of thread, the ar has 41mm.

I dremeled out the damage inside the actuator hole and also managed to remove the bottom bearing (which was knackered). I've patched up the outside of the case with some epoxy metal, hopefully it will stop any leaks.

I'll order some new bearings but if that doesn't sort it I'll be utterly stumped.

[gregorious77]

My AR has a fair bit of play which is annoying because I have fitted a hydraulic conversion and the extra play makes my biting point too close to the bars sometimes.

[jim157]

Right, the damaged actuator hole has been sorted and new bearings fitted. Actuator arm now seems to move smoothly but the problem is still present. I've returned it back to the original plates (which are within wear specs) along with the standard mk3 judder springs and used the old mk3 cable. Despite this I still need to use all the adjustment at the actuator and lever ends to eliminate all the slack in the cable.

I've also tried it with a new set of plates but removed the judder springs and it's still the same.

Here's a couple of pics showing the actuator arm:-

Lever not pulled:-


Lever pulled in:-


Does it look like it's in the correct position?

What do you think my next course of action should be? Would a ball bearing inserted between the end of the lifter rod and the lifter help remove the slack?

Thanks again for your advice....

[fallenmikethebike]

Right, the damaged actuator hole has been sorted and new bearings fitted. Actuator arm now seems to move smoothly but the problem is still present. I've returned it back to the original plates (which are within wear specs) along with the standard mk3 judder springs and used the old mk3 cable. Despite this I still need to use all the adjustment at the actuator and lever ends to eliminate all the slack in the cable.

I've also tried it with a new set of plates but removed the judder springs and it's still the same.

Here's a couple of pics showing the actuator arm:-

Lever not pulled:-


Lever pulled in:-


Does it look like it's in the correct position?

What do you think my next course of action should be? Would a ball bearing inserted between the end of the lifter rod and the lifter help remove the slack?

Thanks again for your advice....

I still think the arm is to far forward, is there any possibility the stem on the actuator arm has been twisted ?
Or is just severely worn away ?
When I've seen a ball bearing used in the clutch it's immediately behind thrust bearing, where it would be in a captive type of arrangement, ie unable to escape to the rest of the engine internals and cause catastrophic damage
The push rod, will give the maximum dia, of the ball bearing that can be used, if you decide to investigate this as a solution.
Mike

[jim157]

Thanks Mike, I've tried two different actuator arms and they are both the same. I'm just wondering if I've done something completely stupid but I've had this clutch apart so many times and replaced pretty much every component apart from the lifter rod and thrust bearing assembly.

I'm pretty much at the point where I'm completely stumped...

[gregorious77]

I know mine is an AR but this might give an indication of travel and start position.
Mine does not move far but does fully disengage the clutch.

[jim157]

That's very helpful, thanks. I'll strip it down again and see if I can manage to get the actuator to sit in a similar position.

[fallenmikethebike]

If all else fails one of these would give you back some adjustment,
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Solderless-Ni ... Vd9CTazWIA
However, the underlying problem of the lever being to far forward would still remain.
Mike

[jim157]

Hi Mike. Yeah, I've got a repair cable so I'm going to try to shorten the mk3 cable to give me some adjustment.

I've a feeling that the problem lies with the damaged casing as I've pretty much replaced everything else. I'm thinking that the casing has been pushed in where the lifter rod meets the actuator arm and therefore is affecting it's path of travel.
Obviously as this is buried deep down there's no way of checking this without stripping down the bottom end, so I'm hoping the shortened cable bodge will work as a short term measure...

[frostoff]

Can't you move the actuator arm backwards on the spline? maybe when you put the cover on it was too far forward. I would try that first, remove the clutch cover and turn the shaft back a couple of splines.

[jim157]

Can't you move the actuator arm backwards on the spline? maybe when you put the cover on it was too far forward. I would try that first, remove the clutch cover and turn the shaft back a couple of splines.

Sorry, I dont quite understand what you mean. As far as I can see the actuator arm can only sit in one position due to it being held by its retaining spring.